Our sources report that last night's City Council meeting was business as usual for the forces of darkness.
After the usual beginning niceties, including congratulations for our Maine South Football Champions, Mayor Howard let everyone know he's a day late and a dollar short on chasing the O'Hare noise problem. While Mayor Howard was doing his Rip Van Winkle impression, when he wasn't voting to pull out of the Suburban O'Hare Commission, the problem of noise and the new runway configuration at O'Hare was creeping up on the citizens of Park Ridge. But now Mayor Howard, and one of his more drooling alderdogs, Don Bachtard (3rd ward), are "challenging the FAA" to provide answers to questions about the jet noise. If either of these idiots had bothered to pay attention to this issue over the last several years, they would find all the answers they're now looking for in the meeting minutes of the O'Hare Noise Compatibility Commission. Or they could have spent an afternoon in the park on the North end of Park Ridge for a taste of things that were to come.
"Challenging the FAA" -- that is very funny stuff!
Next on the council agenda was 1st ward Alderman Dave Schmidt's report and resolution request to put the issue of building a new police station to a referendum vote. In stark contrast to the treatment of every other single resolution undertaken by the council, our sources report that Mayor Howard would not allow Ald. Dave to read an opening statement to begin his report and then offer a motion to adopt the resolution. When Ald. Dave began speaking, Mayor Howard cut him off asking for a motion. Ald. Dave then read the shorter text of the referendum question and motioned the item up for discussion and debate. Mayor Howard then asked for a second to the motion, as required by Roberts Rules of Order, so that discussion and debate could begin. Our sources report that for the first time, Mayor Howard proceeded very slowly through the process of asking for a second -- asking three times if there was anyone to second the motion. All the other aldermen on the council remained silent, and the motion died -- along with the possibility of a public discussion and debate -- for lack of a second.
The PRU Crew feels that, no matter where anyone falls on the issue of building a new police station, everyone should have the guts to discuss, debate and defend their position publicly. And if you are an elected representative of the people, you are obligated to grab hold of your fortitude and tell the people of Park Ridge, in an open forum, why you don't feel they should have a direct and explicit say on the issue through a referendum vote.
We're told two members of the audience rose to address the council after bearing witness to the shenanigans, calling the council's action -- or lack of action -- "appalling" and "sorely disappointing."
The City Council then moved on to other business which included debate and discussion, in great detail, of whether or not to allow businesses to advertise that they have televisions in their establishment, and whether or not minors can play arcade games in an establishment "when accompanied by a person twenty-one years of age." We are told the discussion of keeping our local youth safe from the ills of arcade games took about 30 minutes, and the ordinance passed on a final vote of 5 (Schmidt, Bach, Allegretti, Ryan, and Carey) to 2 (DiPietro and Wsol).
We bet our readers may be wondering why the council was willing to spend a half hour on the minutia of the liquor ordinance, while foregoing any discussion on the potential expenditure of an estimated $20million dollars and a referendum vote. The PRU Crew feels anyone wondering about that should contact their alderman and the Mayor, and ask.
The final highlight in the council's actions last night was to tell PRC Partners, the development entity for Target Area 2 (Uptown), they would have to wait another two weeks before the council would again consider their request to lease space to service provider, Coldwell Banker, instead of a sales tax generating business.
We're told the discussion between the council and two of the partners for PRC began very cordially, but as it became clear the council wasn't in a mood to again give a concession to PRC, the partners became somewhat testy and said the city wasn't likely to ever see the originally promised profit sharing, and that the city should take this deal now. The partners also let it be known that every payment made to the city now, in return for the city's concessions to PRC, is included as an expense that is added to the project. What this means, people, is that PRC is adding expenses to the ledger which will almost guaranty that the city never sees a dime of profit from the project, because if the 11% target return for PRC partners isn't met, then the city is left out of the calculation for profit taking. So, is there anybody out there who would be willing to settle for an 8% return on an investment? We're betting the PRC partners will be just fine with that.
Alderman James Allspaghetti (4th ward) asked what would happen with the potential tenant if the council didn't approve the deal in a timely manner? The partners for PRC said they weren't sure what the potential tenant would do, but that it was important to approve the concession. We are told Allspaghetti then launched into one of his long winded and circular ramblings about approving the concession because the empty spaces in the new development are bad!
We are also told that a member of the audience then rose to address the council and, citing "the interest of full disclosure", said that Coldwell Banker is already leasing space in town and that if they were to move into the new development another, larger space would become vacant.
The PRU Crew has long heard that PRC Partners has spent a great deal of time trying to "canibalize" other local businesses in their efforts to fill up their development.
We give big PRUdos to the council for deferring action on this item until the costs to the city can be more fully understood. However, we're not foolish enough to believe the council will see this one through, and we think PRC will eventually get exactly what they're asking for again.
December 2, 2008
Council Recap -- SSSHHHHH!
Posted by ParkRidgeUnderground
Labels: Dave Schmidt, Howard Frimark, James Allegretti, Park Ridge Police, Park Ridge Uptown, PRC Partners, Referendum
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
41 comments:
Wow. Just wow. I guess I should not be surprised, but I still am. They wouldn't even discuss a referendum???? Not even discuss it???? I don't even know what to say. They continue to ignore us all. It is appalling.
Nothing new. Business as usual. Ignore the people and just keep dealing for the connected friends. Howie isn't done trying to get his buddy Billy boy a nice fat check for his property.
Howie better get busy! As I can see, come April, I know who I am NOT voting for!!!
Ridiculous. There is simply no basis at this time to spend millions of our tax dollars on a police station (do we really need a 30,000 sq ft Taj Mahal for a police department for a town of 38,000) with the city operating in the red now and for the foreseeable future. We are being screwed over by Howard and the brainwashed alderman who support him.
And referring to being screwed over, the city's lack of attention to the affects of the plane noise for those of us in the Belle Plaine corridor is also ridiculous. While I realize that O'Hare is vital to the economic health of this region, Ald Bach and Mayor Frimark completely dropped the ball on trying to find a best case scenario for those of us affected-including for the students at Roosevelt and Washington grade schools. It will be at least 3 years before any work is completed at Washington to mitigate the noise of the jets. And Roosevelt is not even proposed to receive funding for sound abatement work in the next go around. Not alot of learning will be going on with planes flying over every minute or so-just as they are today.
City Hall is useless and powerless on the issue of noise abatement. Contact Durbin and Schakowsky to voice your concerns. You can also contact Lindsey Butler at the Chicago region of the FAA at (847)294-7373.
The new runway is not going to be closed but they can change the approach to fly down a business corridor like Devon. The FAA can also utilize more of the completed runways for landing-like the one over Irving Park Road farther south and the one over Northwest Park-both of which seem to have been forgotten since the new runway opened.
Dear Anonymous...Why do you think diverting planes from the Belle Plaines corridor to the "Devon Avenue business corridor" is a solution to the noise problem from O'Hare? Contrary to what you think, Devon Ave in Park Ridge is not just a "business corridor". There are homes, families, and schools nearby. Your reasoning that planes can't fly over Belle Plaine neighborhoods, but they can bother the people living in the South Park neighborhoods seems very self-serving. I live in the area near Devon and hear the planes taking off and landing along the Higgins route. We hear planes landing on an angle from the Northeast towards O'Hare on warm summer nights, now you want to have more of them flying cross-wise along Devon too? Thanks.
I just sent an e-mail to my alderman about the police station referendum. I expressed my concern about their unwillingness to debate the motion in an open meeting.
If you care about this issue, you should send a note to your alderman as well.
237...we all need to do more than that. The aldermen have served notice that your opinion does not matter. Your e-mail will be deleted in a nanosecond. I suggest a mass outpouring of letters to the editor. And stay tuned; there may be a citizens-initiated petition drive to get the referendum question placed on the ballot. If the movement does materialize, the organizers will need foot soldiers to collect the signatures.
I'm willing to collect signatures...I personally can't wait till Howard and the rest of 'em are gone! They have ruined this great town.
Can some of you expalin what you mean by Devon corridor?
There's no route there plus the higgins corridorr is the Kennedy Expressway route.
The current approach pattern for the new runway takes the planes due west down Pratt from Lake Michigan to O'Hare. Pratt essentially turns into Belle Plaine.
The planes fly within a few blocks either side of Belle Plaine. This takes them over or nearly over 4 schools-Lincoln, Washington, Roosevelt and Maine South. That is over 5,000 students effected everyday-every 90seconds or so while they are in school. Not a safe or sound learning environment.
Devon Ave from the lake to the new runway is more a business corridor than it is a residential corridor. When those of us living on or near Belle Plaine bought our homes anytime within the last 40 years, there was some noise from planes. But there was not the non-stop daily assault we are experiencing now with the new runway and the approach they are using. As of this writing, about 400 flights have flown over my house based on the 90 second interval inbetween flights that has been happening since the first plane went overhead at 6:15 this morning. The runway is open until 10:00 pm.
Using a different approach over Devon may seem self serving to you but the houses closer to Higgins have been noise abated-we have not been and likely will not for many years to come. In addition, the noise south of Devon has been there-the approach down the Kennedy is nothing new and likely was there when you bought your home. So the rules of the game have not changed for you. But the rules have changed for us. This runway is new.
Overnight with this new runway the entire character of our neighborhood has changed. There will be no ability to enjoy our yards and our homes are no longer a refuge for peace. The planes can be heard clearly even with the windows closed and the furnace on. Come summer with the planes flying right over the parks on Western and many peoples yards who is going to want to be outside to enjoy jet noise and fumes? Not many people.
The current approach effects far more people and children and schools than modifying the approach to go more down Devon. In addition, the flights should be distributed amongst all the usable runways-spread out the suffering and the noise.
anon 2:33:
Even though I live right on Belle Plaine and can almost touch the 757's as they fly over, your point is 100% correct.
Seems like the NIMBY mentality applies to all kinds of issues!!
Anon at 5:25-I am a pro-Pads person. I would rather have the homeless one night per week for the winter months than 400+ planes over my house everyday. Don't equate this issue with the fear and hate mongering anti-pads crowd.
I'm 35 and have been aresident of PR for 34 years and though I sometimes find the planes annoying, it's hardly a major eyesore for me.
As I said before I don't exactly live under a flight pattern one who doesn't can still have planes going over then since they often zig-zag around after take off.
Though I can understand a little bit of why this might be diificult I can't understand why this is a much of a problem that you can't enjoy the outdoors on nice days. For 34 years I've gone out on nice days and not a single plane has prevented me from doing this.
Plus how can one breathe in fumes from airplanes? Oh silly can you get? Exhaust from them goes up not down.
I attended elementry school here in PR both Roosevelt and Washington. Didn't disrupt my learning.
I just got an email notifacation that someone can touch the planes.
They're not that low.
Think some of you have too much time on your hands.
The true problem is " safety".
These planes now present
a " High impact crash - zone"
for those homes and schools
in the landing pattern.
Yes - Roosevelt school is directly
in the path of these planes on final approach!!
Who's ( God forbid) going to get those kids out should a plane develop engine trouble on final approach?
Who's going to alert the residents
in their homes as well ?
We are now a changed state here and its not a matter of if but when.
Daley is playing with fire.
Time to get the class action law suit ready....
Thank you.
anon at 5:54 PM:
chicago and the faa didn't give you a choice about having 400+ planes fly up your butt every day, so only a fool would try to turn that into a pro-pads either/or.
and by the way, what have you been doing to shelter the homeless since the pads folks bailed on park ridge because they thought the laws shouldn't have to apply to them? and if it's more than sitting on your thumb, you have to give your name so it can be confirmed.
Anonymous December 2, 2008 2:09 PM,
The city isn't looking to build a Taj Mahal for the new police station. If they were, they'd be looking to build something smaller than what has been proposed, because the floor area of the real Taj Mahal is actually smaller than what has been proposed for the new police station.
anonymous @554pm--seriously? you HAVE TO bring up PADS again? How completely off topic!
THE
ISSUE
IS
DEAD
WITH
PADS.
Please go away. While we were dealing with all of you white shirts, the city was spending away all of our tax dollars right under our noses.
PADS pulled out. Are you living in a cave?!!!!
Don't give up, Alderman Dave!
Anon@6:37: Why is this a sudden "safety problem"??? It wasnt such an issue when Maine East, Ben Franklin Elementary, and Lutheran General Hospital were (and at times, still will be) part of your "high impact crash zone"???
Sounds like the textbook definition of Not [Over] My Backyard...
Three things:
1. Frimark and Bach are idiots. Challenging the FAA? I got news for them. In the world of the FAA they are a speck of dirt on a fly’s ass.
2. I agree with Anon 8:24. I live on the north end of town and I think the new runway is wonderful. The reduction in noise up here is great.
3. As for Anon 6:37, the term you use “High impact crash - zone", hmmm where have I heard it before? Oh yes Ron “Peotone is an investment” Weitecha used it all the time. It’s a made up term. Nowhere does any credible agency use that wording as legitimate defining terminology. It is made up language used to frighten people.
I’m sorry you have more airplane traffic noise to deal with, but after you have lived with it as much as we have I’ll be happy to hear your complaints. Get back to me in thirty years.
Hey anonymous dingbats on belle plaine, did you forget there are two schools even larger than washingon and lincoln off of Devon? Those would be Rooselvelt and Maine South. What dream world were you living in when you say there were no planes flying over belle plaine when you bought your house? I live between the two streets and you sound nuts!!!!
High Impact crash zone.
Yes - been there as a first
responder UA Flt # 191.
Spent 4-5 hours on that site.
Could wipe out an entire block
radius.
Let's hope we can get some reilef
with a cap.
anon 10:16:
Two points.
First I agree with the comment you made about the schools. Devon is no better suggestion versus Belle Plaine. The only thing better about it is that the poster who suggested it does not live there.
Second, I live on Belle Plaine near Main South. I know that there have been planes that fly over prior to this - for god sake the city is virtually next to Ohare! But I will tell you the complaints you read and hear around town are because this is a dramatic change. I would invite you to stand on Belle Plaine and Talcott at lunch time or at about 6-7 PM.
I suggest you take a deep breath and let people blow off a little steam. It will not change anything but it makes us feel a little better for a few moments.
Fighting the FAA on flight patterns is like trying to make the sun rise in the west. The FAA has one goal.....safe, on-time departures and arrivals. The goverment was happy to approve Mayor Daily's O'Hare expansion plan. More run ways means more take off and landing slots available. Don't stop complaining to the agencies, I haven't. But, to date, it has not worked in any, and I repeat, any major city in the US.
PADS??? WTF. It is a old news.
Police station? Only goverment can spend money they don't have. Oh..wait...what am I saying???? everyone one can spend money they don't have. We have the US goverment to bail us out!
Hate mongering anti-pads crowd!!!??? Are you serious? The pads people are the hate mongering crowd. "Agree with me or you're hate mongering." Give me a break!
Back on point..perhaps the reason Howard wants a nice police station is because he fears he'll eventually be arrested for all the crap he's done and wants a nice place to stay. It happened to the Niles mayor...
anon @ 9:41: You are right on all counts.
What's the use of complaing about O'Hare?
Think the real reason why O'Hare's expanding is because the airlines are increasing flights because there's more demand.
Unless that's complete nonsense and you feel they're sending out planes have empty and of course who can control incomming flights?
If there's enough people comming to visit then that means more incomming flights.
Mike:
I do not even know where to begin. I should state up front that I am far from an expert on this whole issue but I guess I will start with a link.
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/081203/united_airlines_traffic.html?.v=1
I would also mention that a big part of why they sold this runway deal (along with safty) was a way of reducing delays and better servicing existing capacity. Unfortunately a project like this takes 10 years from start to finish and things change during that time period.
The planes that now fly over my house (there goes another one) are not increased capacity but the same old capacity only redirected.
Lastly, the vast majority of O'hare flight volume have nothing to do with people coming to visit. Most passangers arriving at O'hare do so only to catch a connecting flight and head off to their final destination.
The main reason I have a problem with the new runway is it appears that it was sold the public in a way they had no intention of using it (like I should be shocked by that!!) They said only smaller planes and mainly for bad weather situations. That is not what they are doing.
Can't they send people to their destinations without changing flights?
I know that's nothing new but I would think most people who fly don't wish to do that?
I also wonder while both the route over Bell Plane and the expressway are being used at the same time, I wonder if that 1 sandwiched in between Foster and Lawerence Aves. is being used just as much.
I don't spend too much time in my living room and it's hard now to look that far with all the trees in the way.
Hell, no, I don't want any more traffic down Devon. When I was calling daily to the O'Hare sound complaint line, my fine neighbors to the north could care less. (After all, it wasn't in their back yard.) Now the noise is just fine down here. Keep it up your way.
When Ron Weitecha was still given money to SOC, he got slammed for trying to avert the plane issue that has now come home to roost. The conventional wisdom was to ridicule him. Guess he was right.
One has only to look at all the empty homes in Bensenville seized by Mayor Daley, [whose futures are now uncertain due to the cold feet of the airline industry] to get an idea of what complaining about the airplane noise will accomplish. There was never a chance of winning this fight, ever, unless somehow, someway the senate was convinced to oppose the expansion of O'Hare. Fat chance of that.
Anon at 5:54 - Was that an option???? I didn't know we could have traded the PADS shelter for the runway. Shit, I wish I'd have known that.
The real solution to the problem would have been to divert all commercial flights (ie. FedEx, UPS, etc) to a new airport in Peotone and reserve O'Hare strictly for passenger flights.
Please do not spend taxpayer money on a O'hare Noise Abatement Group like Ron Wietecha did. This is nothing your city can do to help . We now have new runways and a new flow of landings/takeoffs. We bought our homes with the understanding of the vicintiy of O'hare. Forming and funding a anti noise coalition will just pad the pockets of political friends and provide absoulutely no impact on airport traffic.
Police station petition.
If anyone is interested in gathering signatures to place an advisory referendum on the next ballot, I have one drafted based on Alderman Schmidt's attempt to allow the taxpayers of Park Ridge decide whether or not we should spent over $24 million (includes interest but not operational and maintenance costs) in front of the City Council. I will need at least 25 volunteers that would be willing to gather at least 100 signatures each. I am researching exactly how many we would need. Time is of the essence since our City Council is afraid to ask this question. They are committed to going forward without our input.
If you are interested, please email me at jjegan1@aol.com. I would also need someone to co-lead this effort.
Anon@602: Couldnt get your link to work but you are right on a couple points:
"A project like this takes 10 years from start to finish..." at the very least, but we are not really at the finish are we? My understanding is that this is only phase I of the overall expansion (not that they will complete all the originally proposed phases), but was the "...only smaller planes and mainly for bad weather situations" for this interim between phases or for after the overall completion? The supposed grand scheme was to have 6 parallel E-W runways and the newest thorn in PR's side is only number 3 (and the northernmost). The previous runway configuration had 3 pairs of parallel runways but only one pair could be fully utilized at a time. The newest runway makes 3 E-W and they still have the other 2 pair (NE-SW & NW-SE). Was there any indication that a spike now may ease a little later? Maybe if/when all 6 runways are in, the smaller plane/bad weather scenario is more of an option? But should we really be thinking that they spent all this money for the new runway AND A NEW TOWER, but they cant use it just yet?
Put it this way... if you had a young family, expecting your first child, and owned three 2-seat cars. To start, you might upgrade one of them. But dont you think the new one might get used a bit more til the others are upgraded also? Now say something happens (hypothetically like an economic downturn) and the overall plan to upgrade all 3 of your cars gets delayed or completely revised. Should you feel guilty that you now use the newer car more than the others? Maybe you should force yourself to squeeze everyone into the older cars just to even out the usage patterns? Or maybe one person gets left home alone on some trips just because? Or would you use them as was convenient for your needs until the original plan is fulfilled or taken in a new direction? (like the kid learns to drive himself...) You know what they say about the best laid plans of mice and men...
Your other point of "...not increased capacity but the same old capacity only redirected" is fairly accurate and does mean that the increase in flights to the new runway results in a decrease in traffic elsewhere. Anon@909pm-12/2 is seeing those benefits now. Eventually, Palatine, Rolling Meadows, Arlington Heights, etc. will see almost no traffic at all if the whole plan is realized since the NW-SE runway pair are supposed to be taken out of service. Unfortunately, the others are to remain. So PR will get some of the planes either way...question is just: south side or north side? Both?
Hot line numbers to call and ask them to please place a "cap" on these planes!! if you care about your investment/home:
Brian Gilligan
Asst. Dir
ONCC
773-686-3198
or the back up line
773-732-9322
Thank you.
Note to Mike:
Yes - they are that low!
Mike:
In answer to your 6:34 post you pose the question, "Can't they send people to their destinations without changing flights?"
Again, I am not an expert. My experience comes as a business traveler - not as an employee of an airline.
The way that the airline industry and our flight system in the US is designed I believe the answer to your question in many cases is NO.
The current air travel system in the US is built on a Hub and spoke design. All the smaller regional airports fly into a Hub, where a person changes planes to fly to their ultimate location. If you want to fly from Madison, Wisconsin to NYC you have to fly through another airport (in most cases Ohare). The idea is that they can fill larger planes by shuttling smaller airport passangers into one location.
There are other factors that add to the problem. Many business travelers choose to stay with one airline and there are limited flights to certain areas. For example, I fly American Airlines and I get to San Antonio on business often. There are only two direct flights a day from O'hare to SA. I can get there a million ways through Dallas or St. Louis. Also, many non-business travelers fly with connections because their trip is less time sensitive and traditionally dirct flights cost more money.
The latest data I have found says that 60% of flights into O'hare have connections.
What we are witnessing is the failure of "democracy." Bachtard is your garden variety idiot who probably doesn't even have a real job and never accomplished anything in his life. He looks like a cherry Marine. Don't you ever wonder how such morons get into office? And Frimark looks like a retarded inbred.
If you want real change, start thinking bigger, like getting rid of the twin evils of democracy and predatory capitalism. The two go hand in hand and you no longer own or have any say so in the operation of your government. It was bought, even at the local level, a long time ago.
But boy do they love to put on a charade that you can actually get involved and make a difference. If you had any real voice, would they so nonchalantly disregard commonsense concerns and do as they please? Would a complete hard ass numskull prick like Bachtard have any power in any kind of decent system? I don't feel sorry for the people who vote for such an idiot.
You've bought into this canard of people's rights, but from your complaining it sounds like you don't have any rights and your elected representatives obey higher powers. It's time to scrap the system municipal, state and federal. Otherwise I can hardly feel sorry for people who complain about an already dead system.
At Today's O'Hare Noise Compat Comm
mtg - here is who didn't show up
to support the city with these 300+
planes daily:
- Frimark ( on a plane to Fla ? )
- Kotowski
- Jan S.
- Dick Durban
Wow........
Once again Frimark has proven what a worthless and ineffective leader he is. Let's hope that come election time no one is stupid enought to support Frimark-a person who cares so little about the city he lives in and the people who live here and pay the taxes and vote. Our taxes keep going up and the level of services we get keeps going down.
Post a Comment