Last week a PRU reader posted a comment (#12) and link address to a news piece, on our post "Oh, The Cow Goes...", discussing an unfortunate incident that has resulted in the death of one man and possible murder charges being filed against another man. The alleged offender gave his address as being 1140 E. Northwest Highway in Palatine, which many of you now know is the Journeys from PADS to Hope day center.
The commenter queried, "I'm also wondering if the 4 "tree trimmer wannabes" in the news story are also part of the much ballyhooed "Lawn Service" run by the service provider in question?" The PRU Crew is wondering about that too. We have no proof that the men in the news piece are in any way connected with the Journeys Lawn Service. But the following ad, featured in this past Sunday's St. Paul of the Cross church bulletin --
-- gave us pause, and a chance to once again remind Park Ridgians of the need to be cautious about whomever you hire to do work around or inside your home.
We did not find any business registration for Journeys Lawn Service with the Illinois Secretary of State office. In fact, the only mentions we've seen of the Journeys Lawn Service is on their web site and in the St. Paul bulletin.
We also do not believe the Journeys Lawn Service would be subject to licensing demands by the City of Park Ridge because they would probably qualify as a charitable organization under article 12.pdf of the city's municipal code.
The PRU Crew feels that trying to provide the homeless with "job skills, time management, cooperation and responsibility" are admirable goals. However, the questions about Journeys from PADS to Hope's screening process and background checks remain -- and whether or not the men in the news story were a part of the Journeys Lawn Service or just "freelancing".
We caution Park Ridgians to ask any business they engage for work on their property some very basic questions --
1. Is the business licensed in any way?
2. Is the business insured?
3. Are the employees background checked?
4. Are the employees bonded?
5. Is there an available list of references that can be checked?
Remember, caveat emptor.
October 13, 2008
Caveat Emptor!
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41 comments:
I am sure that St. Paul or the news papers don't check up on their advertisers, but that is because they might not be aware of who really is advertising in their publications.
In this instance, Ms. Timm can't make that claim. I think she should be more careful before advertising to parishioners about services by agencies that could have some questionable characters employed.
I get the part about charity and all that, but the news article makes it pretty clear that PADS isn't the usual business type.
Thanks to the PRU for the consumer safety reminder and message.
You're welcome.
If PADS is required to be licensed by the city to run their "shelter program" than I would think that any other Journey from Pads to Hope "staff supported" program would still be liable. BTW... according to PADS there have only been 3 clients that have been continuously employed in the "lawn program" since spring of 2007. Not an enormouly successful program thus far. Remember... you can ONLY lead a horse to water...
A homeless shelter isn't a commercial endeavor and is subject to special use requirements under the zoning code. The Journey lawn service is a commercial endeavor operating out of their Palatine offic but falls under the charity organization in the code. That's how I read it.
I'm not sure who would be liable if anything were to go wrong if a person hired their lawn service. I don't know if they ask for any waivers to be signed or anything. I've never hired them and I don't intend to. We take care of our own landscape work.
e pluribus unum.
This all started with the PRMA looking to help the Park Ridge homeless. Well it morphed into importing the general homeless population into Park Ridge to share space with elementary school children. Now we are being asked, because it is our Christian duty, to hire the homeless to work around our homes. Will the next phase, in the PRMA's grand vision, be to have the taxpayers provide lost cost or free permanent housing for this valuable work force? After all we need to show surrounding communities how caring we are in Park Ridge.
If your interested go to the South Park website Season 11 and watch Night of the Living Homeless
I wonder what a half page full-color ad in the St. Paul bulletin costs? Does anybody think that PADS/Journeys lawn service actually paid for it?
It's really starting to look like this thing is so kinked up that we might as well be in Chicago and PADS could be run by one of Daley's nephews. Somebody's getting greased on this deal.
OK, one more time now
"This is your elected official, this is your elected official when under the influence of power and money"
Remember, "just say no" or , just vote those out who don't want to listen to the people.
This message has brought to you by someone who cares.
Does anyone remember "Raking Mary" she would come around asking to do yard work? I believe she stopped coming around because she started using her rake on people who refused her service and the police stepped in.
The church needs to check out ALL
vendors.
No one is immune from being sued!
People first..........property second.
Thank you.
geeez....you guys don't get it. They are going to open a PADS shelter at the Catholic church. According to their PR Resident and Archdiocese atty, they don't NEED a permit for a PADS shelter.
So why would you expect them to have to have licensing and permits in PR? They will just claim they are affiliated with the Catholic Church and don't need them.
I can't believe I had to explain that.
[wink]
this is so pathetic. Fr carl is so utterly clueless how many vulnerable people are being put at risk with HIS arrogant, asinine, misguided attempt at his heroic homeless shelter.
The cute little white haired cauldron lady, the (in fr carl's eyes) annoying children at that school next to the church all will be at risk. I wonder if he took vertus training, or even knows what it is. Oh, and even after you take the stupid class, they keep wanting you to log in MONTHLY and study up on how to keep the kids safe. $%$$^^%%$^&^%#@@#@@!!!!!! ANY PROBLEMS SHOULD BE ON HIS HEAD. HE SHOULD COME BACK FROM WHEREVER HE IS AND APOLOGIZE WHEN THEY HAPPEN if this goes through
Hate to be the catholic church and pads bubble burster..... PADS IS NOT A MINISTRY!!!!!!!
Pads CANNOT receive federal funding under the guise of religious ministry. They are a "not-for- profit agency providing shelter and services to the homeless and those at risk of becoming homeless."
The church's can't call it a ministry because they are not allowed to evangelize to Pads guests "Clients".
I guess it's the 'ol "WE'RE NOT A RELIGIOUS MINISTRY...EXCEPT WHEN WE'RE A RELIGIOUS MINISTRY"
WHAT?!?!?!?!?!?!?
Hats off to those who think this is any kind of legitimate argument
and actually have the balls to use it in public while maintaining a straight face. It earns high scores for the entertainment value alone.
anonymous @7:13---you are absolutely right. it's hard not to just BURST INTO LAUGHTER when these people are talking.
I love the paranoia. I continue to be astounded by the energy expended to be pissed off, frustrated and looking for conspiracies. What a laugh. This is better entertainment than reality TV.
Folks. Take a sec and look at yourselves in the mirror. Come on. Don't you see yourselves getting a little lathered-up with conjecture, innuendo and half truths? Do you really think there are all these evil people working for their personal gain (what gain) to harm our little pinched up community?
By the way, anybody ever call Ms Timm and ask her anything about her staff?
SEE?
I see -mouse,
ya know, laughter IS the best medicine.
If laughter is the best medicine, then PADS must be a cure for homelessness, because I think the whole program is a complete joke.
The only pissed off, frustrated, lathered up people I see are those pinched-up sumaritains who aren't getting their way, by making "their way" EVERYBODYS" way.
The nasties that come out of come of those mouths.....you should be ashamed of yourselves. I'm sure at some point in your lives someone tought you better.
Mind your manners
Anon 9:48,
Very well riten. U learned good in skool.
PRU:
I agree with the general message of your post which, as I see it, is that we ALL should be careful to check out all those whom we choose to hire to work in, or aound our homes. That is a great reminder but.............
I do feel compelled to point out the irony that this reminder was motivated by an ad for a lawn service that employees homeless people.
May I ask anyone here what they know about there own lawn service? There have to be 100+ such services that service homes in the city of Park Ridge. How many of them are liscensed by PR? Who checks? I went to the link you provided and checked on a few services that work at some of the homes in my neighborhood. Guess what - they didn't appear to be listed! Maybe it has to do with the way I typed it versus the way the data is listed but what do you know about the employees? Have background checks been done on these employees? Fingerprint checks? I could go off into a Lou Dobbs/Bill O'Reilly rant on illegal imigration but I am not sure I could stomach it.
My point is that the likelyhood of this service employing "questionable characters" is not one bit more than the current service that you, or your neighbor use. So if you have been comfortable all these years with your current service, if the idea of rogue lawn service employees has not kept you up at night with the shivers, then you should have no problem with this service. Whether you decide to hire them is, of course your choice.
Anon@10:41 --
You read the general message of our post correctly. We feel the inspiration for it wasn't ironic or unfounded.
We disagree very strongly with your equating a Journeys Lawn Service, which is little more than a side interest to the main focus of the Journeys organization run by social workers, to any other lawn service run by businessmen. In doing that you ignore the elevated level of problems among the homeless population and diminish those real businessmen, small and large, who comprise the backbone of the American system of capitalism, which we're big fans of.
We're aware of quite a few Park Ridge based service providers who have taken a deep interest in the good of our community. The issues of insurance and licensing were brought to the attention of the city by these local providers two years ago, before most everyone had heard of PADS, Journeys, and Journeys Lawn Service -- the local lawn service providers' concerns were, and probably remain, the legitimacy of operators and liability and potential dangers for homeowners and the city. We're going to go ahead and assume their interests aren't left off the table by them when they do their hiring; we stipulate that is only an assumption. The change over in council seats left the issues on the table and the Frimark administration hasn't picked it up again.
I am pretty sure lawn services need a license to operate in PK. Each truck needs to have a PR license (Sticker) on the front windshield. If any lawn service does not have sticker, they could be ticketed for not being licensed.
Anyone (PRU or another interested party) could probably ask or FOIA the city to get the list of landscape contractors that have licenses. And when you see a truck without a sticker or not on the list parked in front of a PR house, anyone could call the cops to complain.
Anon@10:41 --
A very quick check of 4 local landscape companies with the Secretary of State Corp/LLC lookup turned up 3 listings. It may be that the fourth and least familiar to us is listed under a corporation name that isn't the owner's name or the local company name -- not an unusual thing.
We all know for the most part, that most, not all, but must of the actual work in landscape is down by illegal's. I said "work". If actual background checks and finger printing of all employee's was done, you would be cutting your own yard and raking your own leaves. The advise is to do your homework and work with someone you actually know just like what you would do if you needed someone to come into your home to do some work.
Is the 10:41 post from Todd Stull?
PRU:
As I said in my original post, I will stipulate that the information on a company in the state database may not have matched the words I typed in in my search.
The intent of my post was not to in some way belittle or insult the local lawncare providors. I agree with your comments about these people as businessmen and I have no concerns about the safty of the community from these service providors. By the way, just in case you were wondering, I too love capitalism.
However, I do maintain that someones concerns about "questionable characters" is just as applicable to any of these services as it is to a PADS lawncare service. I will repeat that you or I know nothing about who they employ. They may even employee some people who are currently homeless (oh no!!!!!!).
I find it interesting that we are willing to give them the benefit of the doubt. Hell, for all these years it has not concerned anyone. Yet you attach this business to the homeless issue and NOW we have an issue!
Anon@7:36 --
You've made a pretty stong assumption there. We caution everyone that because a person appears to be of Mexican or Hispanic descent doesn't mean they are in the United States illegally.
By your reasoning Anon@7:36, If actual background checks and finger printing of all employee's was done, not only would many people be cutting their own yard and raking their own leaves, they would also be milling their own lumber, butchering and packing their own meat, cleaning their own hotel rooms, harvesting their own produce, and busing their own restaurant tables.
I believe that the moderator has the ability to tell you that I am not Mr. Stull. But of course all those who have a slightly different opinion can be labeled as either PADS employees, PRMA members or Father Carl.
Where have all the recent large crackdowns been taking place? And your point is?
Anon@8:03 --
We repeat that we strongly disagree. The Journeys Lawn Service is not comparable to other lawn care services simply because Journeys has slapped that title on this endeavor. The fact that they employ the homeless makes their "employees" somewhat more questionable. The homeless population has undeniable problems at levels that exceed the general population -- those problems aren't only economic.
PRU:
I guess we just have to agree to disagree on the point I was trying to make. To be clear, that point is NOT that we have anything to fear from lawn care businesses. The point is that we know as much about the work force in this industry as we do about the homeless - NOTHING!! No back ground checks and/or fingerprint checks. But we are all OK with that. Now take a bunch of homeless people cutting your lawn and we have an issue. Again, to be clear, I am 100% in agreement with your original point of all of us being careful in checking all who we hire.
If someone wanted to they could google the words "lawn, care, illegal, immigrants" and see a variety of information such as the below link:
http://www.columbiatribune.com/2008/Jan/20080131News004.asp
It would appear this was in MO - is that not the land of the chainsaw homeless person that was used on the blogs?
I am heartened with your reply to the poster about all in lawn care being illegal aliens. I absolutely agree with you that it is wrong to assume that all or even a majority of any group match our preconceived notions!!!
watch out for the full moon.
I couldn't agree with you more! The point is, as is yours, reguardless of what type of service you render, do your homework!
There is good and bad in every walk of life. Yes the ratio is much higher in homeless. However, you can not categorize all homeless as bad. Do your homewrk before you contract. If we discriminate against all, the ones who do want to get out and live a normal life will never get the chance. How do we screen the good from the bad? I wish I had the utopian answer.
I don't care whether another lawn care service comes to Park Ridge, or whether it's run by drunken homeless child molesters - because we have no idea whether the other lawn care businesses are run by drunken homeless chld molesters, either.
But what is St. Paul doing endorsing this one particular lawn service, especially with a non-local company that has known alcoholics, drug addicts and the mentally ill?
PRU, coupling the ad from the SPC church bulletin with the story out of Palatine is invaluable. Thank you.
If Adrienne Timm, Fr Carl, Mayor McCheese and the majority of aldergoons are willing to throw CHILDREN under the bus in their PADS folly, what on earth makes you think they give a hoot about you grown ups hiring landscapers?
It is your own fault for having the means to farm out your yard work if you get, um, murdered. But at least it gives some addicted felonious type a shot at functional life skills for a few hours...right?
If I needed another reason never to step foot in my old church, this would be it. That news story about the beating death by PADS 'client' in Palatine broke before the weekend, before the church bulletin came out. Adrienne Timm's/Fr Carl's conduct in posting that ad is either grossly negligent or willfully maleficent. Given what I know about them now, I am going with the latter.
People of Park Ridge, we MUST keep PADS out!!!
Was that hollowing the other evening..screams of joy or pain!
Howie must be back.
Oh well!
To me the point is simple. Yes, we are all ressponsible for checking into anyone that we hire -and if we choose to employ people who are not bonded and insured and licensed - we are taking that chance at our own risk. Personally - I do not employ anyone without proper liscensing, bonding, insurance and in the case of my childcare provider - background checks and fingerprinting.
However, I actually have no problem with people trying to give homeless people a job doing lawn service or something productive. What I do have a problem with is that SPC should not be advertising this in their bulletin without fully explaining the program, who it employs and - - once again - if there are regulations in PR about employing services - they should follow the laws governing the city. And - in light of everything going on to divide this parish and community - you would think (or maybe you wouldn't) that Carl would think twice before creating yet another potential safety issue...
What is next.... ????
To Anonymous Oct.14,2008 at 8:38 AM,
Are you trying to compare racial prejudice to preconceived notions you think people have about the homeless? Do you mean preconceived notions about homeless people, like statements like "70 percent of shelter guests were substance abusers, mentally ill or both" or "65 percent of the homeless population in the northwest suburbs who seek shelter have a mental illness"?
You maybe should contact Scott Block, director of McHenry County PADS and Journeys from PADS to HOPE because they are responsible for saying those things about the homeless. Maybe you should tell them to get over their preconceived notions.
By the way, those quotes came from these two article, respectively:
1. http://www.pioneerlocal.com/
arlingtonheights/news/691705,ah-shelters-121307-s1.article
2. http://www.pioneerlocal.com/
schaumburg/news/691706,sc-meds-121307-s1.article
Some of us do our homework.
Why aren't any anti-PADS citizens circling the wagons and filing a lawsuit against the city to prevent the zoning to allow for the shelter to be located near schools?
anon 8:06:
My comment was aimed at a very simple point which I believe I stated fairly clearly. To quote myself:
"The point is that we know as much about the work force in this industry as we do about the homeless - NOTHING!!"
I was responding to the concerns about a homeless lawn care company and simply pointing out that we know nothing about the employees of lwan care companies, large and small, that current work in our town.
I understand the concerns about a school gym. I understand the concerns about a shelter across the alley. But to say now that this is such a concern that we have fear about a business that gives this group an opportunity to make some money, learn some skills and gains some confidence/self-esteem to work there way back into the work place seems a bit overboard, at least to me.
By the way, you would find many people who are in the "anti-immigration", close the borders, deportation movement who would throw statistics and individual incidents out there about crime related to that population. There position makes me queesy but they do it anyway.
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